Arthur D. Hlavaty

Now what? @ 01:09 pm

Tags: blog

We lost, and now what do we do? First thing I'll do is sound like a liberal. Let's not assume that all the millions who voted for Bush are the bad guys. Some believed that the threat of terrorism is so serious, and Bush's response to it so much better than Kerry's, that it overcame any misgivings about his economic policies, approach to rights and liberties, etc., as a matter of sheer survival. I think they're mistaken, but I might be.

That said, there a lot of people who like what is worst in Bush--the people who voted to deny marriage rights to gays in all eleven states where the question came up, the antiabortionists who should not be called "fetus fans" because they are primarily concerned with the cost of sex being high enough (especially for women), the ones who cling to their racial and religious hates--and who don't care what else he does as long as he panders to what is worst in them. The vast majority of them are not going to be really helped by Bush, and as far as I'm concerned they don't deserve any better. I just wish they weren't taking us along with them.

The other side of that coin is that almost 50% of the population voted against Bush, and they are not going away either. Let's not overestimate the extent to which we are "surrounded." Furthermore, while we can assume that Bush will make a mess, he may not make an irrevocable mess, and he may make one obvious to a majority before the next congressional elections or at least by 2008.

There are still organizations that will work against Bush. Let us all find at least one to do more for. Here is a useful list of such organizations from

ladykathryn, complete with links. I'm going to give a lot more support to the ACLU, which will have much to do in the next four years.

I'm still a science fiction type who believes that new ideas can save us. Perhaps science will come up with an improvement on RU-486 that requires only a single dose to abort, and it can be bootlegged--as illegal as a vial of crack and as hard to obtain.

Meanwhile, keep living and keep loving. Write, organize, change minds one on one--whatever you do best. And remember what the great Yogi said: It ain't over till it's over.

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From:	roya_spirit
Date:	November 3rd, 2004 06:18 pm (UTC)

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Re: abortives...

What we need is to go back to learning what works >without< getting the drug companies involved in it. Women's wisdom has worked for many years in many cultures, and we can get back to it if we just can find that knowledge once more.

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From:	noveldevice
Date:	November 3rd, 2004 07:31 pm (UTC)

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The reason the legal abortion was something considered devoutly to be praised is because it really does work better than anything that came before. Herbal abortions are all about timing and dosage. If you get either wrong, you're screwed. If the timing is wrong, you merely injure the fetus, or do nothing to it at all. If the dosage is wrong, you're either still pregnant, or, more probably dead. If you want an herbal abortion, you have to nerve yourself up to do something about it RIGHT AWAY. You do not have three weeks to think about it.

In addition, think of all the women with tubal pregnancies who need a surgical abortion to save at worst their life, or at best their reproductive future. Think of the women whose fetuses die in the second or third trimester and need a surgical extraction who can't get one.

These are medical procedures that require expertise. They must continue to be taught, and they must continue to be offered.

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From:	roya_spirit
Date:	November 4th, 2004 01:26 pm (UTC)

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I am not against medical abortions. I've had two of them, and thank my stars that they were legally available to me, although I had to travel to another state to get one of them.

My argument was against relying on drug companies to provide pills. Drug companies have a major stock in only one thing, ..making money by convincing the public that natural remedies don't work, or outright banning them.
I'm also saying that IF legal abortions become unavailable, we need to have more information than what the drug companies thrust down our throats.

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From:	noveldevice
Date:	November 4th, 2004 01:38 pm (UTC)

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I'm sorry...you were getting some of my frustration at all the posts I've seen saying "Bush was re-elected, well, we don't need surgical abortions, we'll take herbs and they'll work better because they're natural!"

It makes me cringe. And I also cringe because it seems like a segment of the female population is willing to let a right to medical care which was so hard-won and is so desperately needed go without a fight.

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From:	roya_spirit
Date:	November 4th, 2004 06:49 pm (UTC)

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I understand. Oh no, I put my money where my mouth is.
I choose to have my pelvic tune-ups done at Planned Parenthood instead of using my insurance because I believe strongly in what they espouse. AND they provide a great service in this college town.

It's a scary time to think that over half the states are poised to take our right to choose away from us, and willing to let women die for that cause. It really creeps me out.

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From:	lysana
Date:	November 3rd, 2004 07:48 pm (UTC)

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So long as herbal supplements remain on sale, the means exist on store shelves now. They just get sold for different purposes. Also, Google "menstrual extractor."

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From:	roya_spirit
Date:	November 4th, 2004 01:27 pm (UTC)

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I read about the menstual extractor in Our Bodies Ourselves.
It's a very good alternative, thank you for bringing it up.

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From:	brisingamen
Date:	November 3rd, 2004 06:20 pm (UTC)

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Terrific post ... on the bright side, I remind myself that all those people exercised their democratic right to express an opinion and make a choice. It's unfortunate that I think many of them were wrong, but it's their right to think one thing, mine to disagree.

Meanwhile, keep living and keep loving. Write, organize, change minds one on one--whatever you do best. And remember what the great Yogi said: It ain't over till it's over.

But yes, precisely ... I'm not sure what the fight here is going to be about, come General Election time, as I can't begin to imagine what wonders Blair is going to foist upon us, for our own good, but I for one will make sure I'm clear on the issues and their ramifications, and will act accordingly.

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From:	scarlatti
Date:	November 3rd, 2004 06:22 pm (UTC)

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Thanks for the link to the post about organizations that will need support. I just rejoined the ACLU after having let my card-carrying membership lapse in recent years.

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From:	cheshyre
Date:	November 3rd, 2004 06:30 pm (UTC)

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almost 50% of the population voted against Bush
Almost 50% of those who voted voted against Bush. Don't forget all the people eligible to vote who didn't, and thus supported the status quo.

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From:	supergee
Date:	November 3rd, 2004 06:32 pm (UTC)

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Good point, and let's not write off the nonvoters either.

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From:	adrian_turtle
Date:	November 3rd, 2004 08:42 pm (UTC)

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In Massachusetts, which uses optical scanners for the ballots, we can be reasonably confident that the vote count was accurate. And MA hasn't had extensive reports of vote-suppression in areas where people might be expected to vote for Kerry. (The RNC invalidating thousands of perfectly good voter Democratic Party registrations, or papering poor neighborhoods with flyers saying [falsely] that anyone who came to vote when they owed child support, or had outstanding traffic tickets, or was related to anyone who had been convicted of a felony, would be arrested.) In other states, it was very different. So I'm not at all convinced that the country is in such dire straits as it seems.

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From:	ivymcallister
Date:	November 3rd, 2004 06:52 pm (UTC)

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...Bush's response to it so much better than Kerry's, that it overcame any misgivings about his economic policies, approach to rights and liberties, etc....

My fear stems from knowing that Bush has nothing to hold him back, now--no need to moderate himself even a tiny bit because the possibility of re-election isn't there to make him think twice before opening a can of Right-Wing Christian Conservative Agenda on our asses.

I think we'll see the gloves come off very, very soon. In other words, pro-choice supporters, homosexuals, non-Christians and others are going to need to learn to dodge or take a hit without going down, because the blows will soon be coming hard and fast.

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From:	jerrykaufman
Date:	November 3rd, 2004 07:18 pm (UTC)

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I feel fortunate to be living in a Blue State, with two Democratic Senators. We almost have a Democratic Governor, too, but that race is so close - the last figures I saw had Rossi and Gregoire only about twenty votes apart.

Even in Washington, however, there's a gulf between the eastern part of the state and the western, and between the cities and the suburbs.

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From:	hangedwoman
Date:	November 3rd, 2004 07:48 pm (UTC)

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Well said. I am so grateful for the people trying to appeal to the voice of reason right now instead of hysteria.

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From:	dmsherwood53
Date:	November 4th, 2004 05:14 pm (UTC)

Thanks

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Thanks for being hope full

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From:	purpletigron
Date:	November 6th, 2004 08:12 am (UTC)

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How much money do the ACLU need to effectively counter-act repression in the coming four years? How many members, how much money per existing member?

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From:	supergee
Date:	November 6th, 2004 12:37 pm (UTC)

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More. I couldn't begin to estimate.

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Arthur D. Hlavaty

From the Oval Throne of Pope Guilty I

November 3rd, 2004

Now what? @ 01:09 pm

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Arthur D. Hlavaty

From the Oval Throne of Pope Guilty I